2009 GTHL AA West

Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 4:14 pm Hey, just curious, if your kid doesn’t make AAA in their draft year, is playing U18 AAA still a legit path to the OHL? I’m a bit confused about how someone who’s never played AAA before could jump into U18 AAA and end up getting drafted. Feels like if it were that simple, more kids would be doing it. Any advice or insight would be appreciated.
Yes U18 AAA is a legit path to getting OHL drafted. But the reason more kids don't do it is because they can't do it. It's the same reason they aren't playing U16 AAA. They aren't good enough. And U18 AAA is double age group, so even though the top of the top 16 AAA kids get drafted and are gone, your now combining 2 age groups making it just as unlikely for a AA kid who wasn't good enough back on U16 to make AAA still won't be good enough on U18 to make AAA. But if they could do it I expect they would do it.
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Mississauga Rattlers Appeal Denied. Ontario Hockey Federation
permits the GTHL to break appeal procedures
Ontario Hockey Federation unfairly allowed the GTHL to change rules in appeal hearing process to
support 14-game-loss penalty imposed, parents say.
“Let Them Play” campaign will continue and press for reform of the GTHL.
MISSISSAUGA, ONTARIO, February 26, 2025 --- Following an appeal hearing on Monday evening, the
Ontario Hockey Federation (OHF) denied the Mississauga Rattlers U16 AA Team’s appeal of the Greater
Toronto Hockey League’s (GTHL) decision to assign them 14 game losses over a paperwork error
concerning the registration of a trainer. The parents of the Rattler players have officially responded to
the OHF claiming the appeal panel unfairly allowed the GTHL to change, without notice, which rule it
was penalizing the players under during the appeal.
According to the official OHF appeal document, the purpose of the appeal hearing was, “to determine
whether the GTHL Appeal Committee correctly applied GTHL Rules 9.13, 14.4 and 15.8 in its decision of
16 January 2025 and whether the penalties imposed against the Rattlers U16 AA team should stand or
be changed.”
The GTHL has consistently cited its rule 9.13 (Effect of an Ineligible Player or Team Official Participating in
a Game) since first imposing the game loss penalties on the Rattlers in December 2024 and at the
subsequent appeal hearing in January 2025. Rule 9.13 allows for an exception for an “understandable
mistake”.
It was only during the OHF hearing that the GTHL changed its argument that it was now citing Rule 9.11,
(No Non-Registered Individuals on Bench}. The league did so without informing the OHF or the team
prior to the hearing about this change. Rule 9.11 is much more punitive and has no exceptions for
inadvertent errors.
“Our legal counsel said this should not have been allowed and was a clear abuse of process,” said Jeff
Davis, volunteer team manager and a parent of one of the players. “We had hoped for a fair hearing.”
Specifically, the GTHL convinced the OHF appeal committee that an “understandable mistake”, (while
likely, the OHF noted its decision), had no bearing on Rule 9.11 the GTHL was now quoting in reference
to the 14-game-loss penalty.
In its decision, the OHF wrote, “While unintended, the actions of the Rattlers Association and/or the
relevant team officials, clearly violated Rule 9.11 (first raised by the GTHL at this Appeal hearing). The
Page 1 of 2
Mississauga Rattlers Appeal Denied. Ontario Hockey Federation permits the GTHL to break appeal procedures
February 26, 2025
consequences of this are clearly outlined within the Rule. Further, while the Panel might believe that this
was an ‘understandable mistake’ as per Rule 9.13, such exception does not apply to Rule 9.11.”
Davis said, “At the OHF appeal hearing, we presented our case that the team’s paperwork error was an
understandable mistake. But the change of the rule the GTHL applied from 9.13 to 9.11 made such an
argument irrelevant. The appeal panel should never have been permitted the GTHL’s last minute
change.”
Davis said, “The GTHL was permitted to make many mistakes through this process with no accountability.
They are granted unlimited grace, but the team and volunteers are granted no similar grace for an
understandable mistake.”
The Rattlers were in first place in their division at the time the 14-game-loss penalty was assigned. The
team has since won almost every game to reach 8th place and will compete in the playoffs.
Mieke Gilbert, whose son is a goaltender on the team, said, "Our boys have shown incredible strength
through this. Instead of dwelling on their setback, they have stayed focused, supported each other and
kept playing game they love. They've handled this with maturity beyond their years and we are so proud
of them."
Davis said, “The GTHL will not change without outside pressure. That must come from the Minister of
Sport, GTA municipalities, and the 50 plus associations that make up league.”
The GTHL Let Them Play Campaign will continue as a place where others can share their stories of
mistreatment by the GTHL. The website will help with investigations in an effort to bring real change to
the GTHL for all players, families and volunteers.
Gilbert said, “We are incredibly grateful to the hockey community for standing with us. The support from
the players, parents and teams across this league has meant so much. It is a reminder of what hockey is
really about: camaraderie, resilience, and standing up for what is right. Thank you for being in our
corner. “
The Mississauga Rattlers Hockey Association was founded in 1982. It competes in the GTHL AA West
Division with some 170 players aged 8 to 21 and strives to provide a positive environment for players to
develop both hockey and life skills, while enjoying the thrill and benefits of competing in Canada’s
national winter sport.

For further information contact:
Ted Griffith
[email protected]
416.518.8306
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 4:50 pm Mississauga Rattlers Appeal Denied. Ontario Hockey Federation
permits the GTHL to break appeal procedures
Ontario Hockey Federation unfairly allowed the GTHL to change rules in appeal hearing process to
support 14-game-loss penalty imposed, parents say.
“Let Them Play” campaign will continue and press for reform of the GTHL.
MISSISSAUGA, ONTARIO, February 26, 2025 --- Following an appeal hearing on Monday evening, the
Ontario Hockey Federation (OHF) denied the Mississauga Rattlers U16 AA Team’s appeal of the Greater
Toronto Hockey League’s (GTHL) decision to assign them 14 game losses over a paperwork error
concerning the registration of a trainer. The parents of the Rattler players have officially responded to
the OHF claiming the appeal panel unfairly allowed the GTHL to change, without notice, which rule it
was penalizing the players under during the appeal.
According to the official OHF appeal document, the purpose of the appeal hearing was, “to determine
whether the GTHL Appeal Committee correctly applied GTHL Rules 9.13, 14.4 and 15.8 in its decision of
16 January 2025 and whether the penalties imposed against the Rattlers U16 AA team should stand or
be changed.”
The GTHL has consistently cited its rule 9.13 (Effect of an Ineligible Player or Team Official Participating in
a Game) since first imposing the game loss penalties on the Rattlers in December 2024 and at the
subsequent appeal hearing in January 2025. Rule 9.13 allows for an exception for an “understandable
mistake”.
It was only during the OHF hearing that the GTHL changed its argument that it was now citing Rule 9.11,
(No Non-Registered Individuals on Bench}. The league did so without informing the OHF or the team
prior to the hearing about this change. Rule 9.11 is much more punitive and has no exceptions for
inadvertent errors.
“Our legal counsel said this should not have been allowed and was a clear abuse of process,” said Jeff
Davis, volunteer team manager and a parent of one of the players. “We had hoped for a fair hearing.”
Specifically, the GTHL convinced the OHF appeal committee that an “understandable mistake”, (while
likely, the OHF noted its decision), had no bearing on Rule 9.11 the GTHL was now quoting in reference
to the 14-game-loss penalty.
In its decision, the OHF wrote, “While unintended, the actions of the Rattlers Association and/or the
relevant team officials, clearly violated Rule 9.11 (first raised by the GTHL at this Appeal hearing). The
Page 1 of 2
Mississauga Rattlers Appeal Denied. Ontario Hockey Federation permits the GTHL to break appeal procedures
February 26, 2025
consequences of this are clearly outlined within the Rule. Further, while the Panel might believe that this
was an ‘understandable mistake’ as per Rule 9.13, such exception does not apply to Rule 9.11.”
Davis said, “At the OHF appeal hearing, we presented our case that the team’s paperwork error was an
understandable mistake. But the change of the rule the GTHL applied from 9.13 to 9.11 made such an
argument irrelevant. The appeal panel should never have been permitted the GTHL’s last minute
change.”
Davis said, “The GTHL was permitted to make many mistakes through this process with no accountability.
They are granted unlimited grace, but the team and volunteers are granted no similar grace for an
understandable mistake.”
The Rattlers were in first place in their division at the time the 14-game-loss penalty was assigned. The
team has since won almost every game to reach 8th place and will compete in the playoffs.
Mieke Gilbert, whose son is a goaltender on the team, said, "Our boys have shown incredible strength
through this. Instead of dwelling on their setback, they have stayed focused, supported each other and
kept playing game they love. They've handled this with maturity beyond their years and we are so proud
of them."
Davis said, “The GTHL will not change without outside pressure. That must come from the Minister of
Sport, GTA municipalities, and the 50 plus associations that make up league.”
The GTHL Let Them Play Campaign will continue as a place where others can share their stories of
mistreatment by the GTHL. The website will help with investigations in an effort to bring real change to
the GTHL for all players, families and volunteers.
Gilbert said, “We are incredibly grateful to the hockey community for standing with us. The support from
the players, parents and teams across this league has meant so much. It is a reminder of what hockey is
really about: camaraderie, resilience, and standing up for what is right. Thank you for being in our
corner. “
The Mississauga Rattlers Hockey Association was founded in 1982. It competes in the GTHL AA West
Division with some 170 players aged 8 to 21 and strives to provide a positive environment for players to
develop both hockey and life skills, while enjoying the thrill and benefits of competing in Canada’s
national winter sport.

For further information contact:
Ted Griffith
[email protected]
416.518.8306
Any chance the Minister of Sport will step in and take a position?
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Omg please stfu up already Rattlers and this terrible fixer group. This whole thing you're trying to do is a pointless waste of time and is embarrassing. What are you even complaining for? You didn't miss even 1 single game of hockey, so you played every game of hockey. And you are in the playoffs also. So what exactly is the problem still. Can someone please clarify what the problem is right now? What your record is missing some wins? Who cares. Nobody in the future is going to care at all what your 2nd place record was. This will have no future impact on anything. Did you actually not get to play any games? No again, you played any games. So what are you continuing to complain about and protest? The only thing I can think of that you are protesting for now is because you want to be the 2nd place team because you are scared to play the Panthers in the 1st round. So this whole protest is just because your scared? If that's not it, what else is it? What else is not fair right now or having a real impact on your hockey now?
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:34 pm Omg please stfu up already Rattlers and this terrible fixer group. This whole thing you're trying to do is a pointless waste of time and is embarrassing. What are you even complaining for? You didn't miss even 1 single game of hockey, so you played every game of hockey. And you are in the playoffs also. So what exactly is the problem still. Can someone please clarify what the problem is right now? What your record is missing some wins? Who cares. Nobody in the future is going to care at all what your 2nd place record was. This will have no future impact on anything. Did you actually not get to play any games? No again, you played any games. So what are you continuing to complain about and protest? The only thing I can think of that you are protesting for now is because you want to be the 2nd place team because you are scared to play the Panthers in the 1st round. So this whole protest is just because your scared? If that's not it, what else is it? What else is not fair right now or having a real impact on your hockey now?
Apparently, from what I’ve read, the parents say that somehow having these wins taken against the team affects them because they could’ve been a championship team? I don’t know if he thinks the kids are all going to AAA or the OHL?
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:56 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:34 pm Omg please stfu up already Rattlers and this terrible fixer group. This whole thing you're trying to do is a pointless waste of time and is embarrassing. What are you even complaining for? You didn't miss even 1 single game of hockey, so you played every game of hockey. And you are in the playoffs also. So what exactly is the problem still. Can someone please clarify what the problem is right now? What your record is missing some wins? Who cares. Nobody in the future is going to care at all what your 2nd place record was. This will have no future impact on anything. Did you actually not get to play any games? No again, you played any games. So what are you continuing to complain about and protest? The only thing I can think of that you are protesting for now is because you want to be the 2nd place team because you are scared to play the Panthers in the 1st round. So this whole protest is just because your scared? If that's not it, what else is it? What else is not fair right now or having a real impact on your hockey now?
Apparently, from what I’ve read, the parents say that somehow having these wins taken against the team affects them because they could’ve been a championship team? I don’t know if he thinks the kids are all going to AAA or the OHL?
They can't be this dumb are they? Give them the wins back so they can enjoy 2nd place. They wouldn't have won the division anyways. And this is AA. None of them are getting drafted to OHL this year regardless. And if they want to go U18 AAA this has no impact on their chances to make a team, not that they have much chance. And for any other university hockey or whatever, this grade 10 hockey year means nothing also. So none of these are reasons to still be protesting.
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:56 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:34 pm Omg please stfu up already Rattlers and this terrible fixer group. This whole thing you're trying to do is a pointless waste of time and is embarrassing. What are you even complaining for? You didn't miss even 1 single game of hockey, so you played every game of hockey. And you are in the playoffs also. So what exactly is the problem still. Can someone please clarify what the problem is right now? What your record is missing some wins? Who cares. Nobody in the future is going to care at all what your 2nd place record was. This will have no future impact on anything. Did you actually not get to play any games? No again, you played any games. So what are you continuing to complain about and protest? The only thing I can think of that you are protesting for now is because you want to be the 2nd place team because you are scared to play the Panthers in the 1st round. So this whole protest is just because your scared? If that's not it, what else is it? What else is not fair right now or having a real impact on your hockey now?
Apparently, from what I’ve read, the parents say that somehow having these wins taken against the team affects them because they could’ve been a championship team? I don’t know if he thinks the kids are all going to AAA or the OHL?
I say this with all due respect to AA parents. There isn’t a single AA player in Ontario that will be drafted to the OHL next year unless their parents buy them a spot.
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 6:04 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:56 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:34 pm Omg please stfu up already Rattlers and this terrible fixer group. This whole thing you're trying to do is a pointless waste of time and is embarrassing. What are you even complaining for? You didn't miss even 1 single game of hockey, so you played every game of hockey. And you are in the playoffs also. So what exactly is the problem still. Can someone please clarify what the problem is right now? What your record is missing some wins? Who cares. Nobody in the future is going to care at all what your 2nd place record was. This will have no future impact on anything. Did you actually not get to play any games? No again, you played any games. So what are you continuing to complain about and protest? The only thing I can think of that you are protesting for now is because you want to be the 2nd place team because you are scared to play the Panthers in the 1st round. So this whole protest is just because your scared? If that's not it, what else is it? What else is not fair right now or having a real impact on your hockey now?
Apparently, from what I’ve read, the parents say that somehow having these wins taken against the team affects them because they could’ve been a championship team? I don’t know if he thinks the kids are all going to AAA or the OHL?
I say this with all due respect to AA parents. There isn’t a single AA player in Ontario that will be drafted to the OHL next year unless their parents buy them a spot.

I absolutely agree and with all due respect too, of course. The parents who have dropped so much money into the private hockey schools and teams up to now won’t want to believe this though.
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 6:12 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 6:04 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:56 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:34 pm Omg please stfu up already Rattlers and this terrible fixer group. This whole thing you're trying to do is a pointless waste of time and is embarrassing. What are you even complaining for? You didn't miss even 1 single game of hockey, so you played every game of hockey. And you are in the playoffs also. So what exactly is the problem still. Can someone please clarify what the problem is right now? What your record is missing some wins? Who cares. Nobody in the future is going to care at all what your 2nd place record was. This will have no future impact on anything. Did you actually not get to play any games? No again, you played any games. So what are you continuing to complain about and protest? The only thing I can think of that you are protesting for now is because you want to be the 2nd place team because you are scared to play the Panthers in the 1st round. So this whole protest is just because your scared? If that's not it, what else is it? What else is not fair right now or having a real impact on your hockey now?
Apparently, from what I’ve read, the parents say that somehow having these wins taken against the team affects them because they could’ve been a championship team? I don’t know if he thinks the kids are all going to AAA or the OHL?
I say this with all due respect to AA parents. There isn’t a single AA player in Ontario that will be drafted to the OHL next year unless their parents buy them a spot.

I absolutely agree and with all due respect too, of course. The parents who have dropped so much money into the private hockey schools and teams up to now won’t want to believe this though.
More the issue is with My Hockey Rankings . These wins are getting reversed and hurting the MR ranking and artificially inflating others.
Guest

Re: 2009 GTHL AA West

Post by Guest »

Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 5:10 pm
Guest wrote: Wed Feb 26, 2025 4:50 pm Mississauga Rattlers Appeal Denied. Ontario Hockey Federation
permits the GTHL to break appeal procedures
Ontario Hockey Federation unfairly allowed the GTHL to change rules in appeal hearing process to
support 14-game-loss penalty imposed, parents say.
“Let Them Play” campaign will continue and press for reform of the GTHL.
MISSISSAUGA, ONTARIO, February 26, 2025 --- Following an appeal hearing on Monday evening, the
Ontario Hockey Federation (OHF) denied the Mississauga Rattlers U16 AA Team’s appeal of the Greater
Toronto Hockey League’s (GTHL) decision to assign them 14 game losses over a paperwork error
concerning the registration of a trainer. The parents of the Rattler players have officially responded to
the OHF claiming the appeal panel unfairly allowed the GTHL to change, without notice, which rule it
was penalizing the players under during the appeal.
According to the official OHF appeal document, the purpose of the appeal hearing was, “to determine
whether the GTHL Appeal Committee correctly applied GTHL Rules 9.13, 14.4 and 15.8 in its decision of
16 January 2025 and whether the penalties imposed against the Rattlers U16 AA team should stand or
be changed.”
The GTHL has consistently cited its rule 9.13 (Effect of an Ineligible Player or Team Official Participating in
a Game) since first imposing the game loss penalties on the Rattlers in December 2024 and at the
subsequent appeal hearing in January 2025. Rule 9.13 allows for an exception for an “understandable
mistake”.
It was only during the OHF hearing that the GTHL changed its argument that it was now citing Rule 9.11,
(No Non-Registered Individuals on Bench}. The league did so without informing the OHF or the team
prior to the hearing about this change. Rule 9.11 is much more punitive and has no exceptions for
inadvertent errors.
“Our legal counsel said this should not have been allowed and was a clear abuse of process,” said Jeff
Davis, volunteer team manager and a parent of one of the players. “We had hoped for a fair hearing.”
Specifically, the GTHL convinced the OHF appeal committee that an “understandable mistake”, (while
likely, the OHF noted its decision), had no bearing on Rule 9.11 the GTHL was now quoting in reference
to the 14-game-loss penalty.
In its decision, the OHF wrote, “While unintended, the actions of the Rattlers Association and/or the
relevant team officials, clearly violated Rule 9.11 (first raised by the GTHL at this Appeal hearing). The
Page 1 of 2
Mississauga Rattlers Appeal Denied. Ontario Hockey Federation permits the GTHL to break appeal procedures
February 26, 2025
consequences of this are clearly outlined within the Rule. Further, while the Panel might believe that this
was an ‘understandable mistake’ as per Rule 9.13, such exception does not apply to Rule 9.11.”
Davis said, “At the OHF appeal hearing, we presented our case that the team’s paperwork error was an
understandable mistake. But the change of the rule the GTHL applied from 9.13 to 9.11 made such an
argument irrelevant. The appeal panel should never have been permitted the GTHL’s last minute
change.”
Davis said, “The GTHL was permitted to make many mistakes through this process with no accountability.
They are granted unlimited grace, but the team and volunteers are granted no similar grace for an
understandable mistake.”
The Rattlers were in first place in their division at the time the 14-game-loss penalty was assigned. The
team has since won almost every game to reach 8th place and will compete in the playoffs.
Mieke Gilbert, whose son is a goaltender on the team, said, "Our boys have shown incredible strength
through this. Instead of dwelling on their setback, they have stayed focused, supported each other and
kept playing game they love. They've handled this with maturity beyond their years and we are so proud
of them."
Davis said, “The GTHL will not change without outside pressure. That must come from the Minister of
Sport, GTA municipalities, and the 50 plus associations that make up league.”
The GTHL Let Them Play Campaign will continue as a place where others can share their stories of
mistreatment by the GTHL. The website will help with investigations in an effort to bring real change to
the GTHL for all players, families and volunteers.
Gilbert said, “We are incredibly grateful to the hockey community for standing with us. The support from
the players, parents and teams across this league has meant so much. It is a reminder of what hockey is
really about: camaraderie, resilience, and standing up for what is right. Thank you for being in our
corner. “
The Mississauga Rattlers Hockey Association was founded in 1982. It competes in the GTHL AA West
Division with some 170 players aged 8 to 21 and strives to provide a positive environment for players to
develop both hockey and life skills, while enjoying the thrill and benefits of competing in Canada’s
national winter sport.

For further information contact:
Ted Griffith
[email protected]
416.518.8306
Any chance the Minister of Sport will step in and take a position?
Why not share this part of the decision?

“Further, the bracketed material in 9.13 (b) excludes the understandable mistake provision from applying to this fact situation; specifically, these errors resulted from failures to review either the official game report or the team’s roster form.”

Again, we are back to the trainer not appearing on the game sheet. Four. Teen. Times!

Stop whining and go fire your coach and manager for screwing your season up on you.
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